Categories
- Alticor (87)
- Access Business Group (5)
- Amway (62)
- Quixtar (40)
- Amway Arena (3)
- eCoupled (3)
- Founders (1)
- Fulton Innovation (3)
- Grand Rapids (8)
- Hotels (5)
- Innovation (4)
- JW Marriott Grand Rapids (5)
- Michigan (10)
- Michigan Governor's Race (23)
- Miscellaneous (12)
- Product Lines (7)
- Sponsorships (2)
- Sports (1)
- Transformation (25)
Archives
Alticor Media Blog is the official news weblog from the Alticor family of companies.
October 24th, 2007 @ 8:45 pm ET…
Why we fight, part 1
You can post a comment or trackback from your own site.
After being on the defensive for 20 straight legal attacks, we filed suit yesterday against the corporation that owns TEAM.
We filed suit because the single legal case we brought (and won) in this matter listed Orrin Woodward as a defendant—but Woodward then claimed to have magically disappeared as the manager of TEAM before the case was heard. (A legal trick like that is like pretending Rich and Jay have nothing to do with our company—but never mind. We’ll straighten it out.)
We filed suit because TEAM has had multiple chances to play by the rules in this dispute, but have gambled that they do not have to play by them. They have interfered with non-compete agreements. They have interfered with non-solicitation agreements. They refuse to arbitrate.
But most of all, we are filing suit because TEAM has taken proprietary business information from Quixtar that IBOs could be using right now to build Quixtar businesses.
If you leave your place of work today, you would leave behind your tools and information so that those who remain can carry on the business. You can’t help yourself to your computer, the stapler, the coffeemaker—or the company’s customer list.
That is ethically and morally wrong. It is also legally wrong. And that’s why we filed suit.
Filed by: Corporate Communications
Posted in: Alticor, Amway, Quixtar, Transformation
959 Responses to “Why we fight, part 1” (901 - 959 shown)
Pages: « 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 [10] Show All
Pages: « 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 [10] Show All
November 13th, 2007 at 12:18 am
yeah #893,
Team is LOSING!!!
Folks it’s done.
I spend much less than $350 to get 100 PV. CRAZY, like a fox.
Anne #896,
Do you REALLY believe what some yahoo reporter writes more than the rules and direct statements to the contrary from A/Q? Have you ever considered just because a “distributor” (shows you how up to date this reporter is, the term for the past several years has been IBO, not “distributor”) isn’t needed for the sale doesn’t also mean an IBO doesn’t get credit for the volume?
November 13th, 2007 at 12:28 am
Admin #898,
Yeah, Bo too. Double rollover. I do remember Bo, he was one heck of a coach. Bo and Woody, what a show, both bigger than life. Not being from Michigan, I wasn’t familiar with Bob Ufer, he was apparently more of a locally known guy.
November 13th, 2007 at 1:07 am
Tex:
Still laughing right out loud at your posts; they’re priceless, especially this evening. I’ve been trying to figure out why the insulted bloggers don’t get it. You explain yourself beautifully to Jester311 in #891.
November 13th, 2007 at 1:17 am
Tex Says:
November 12th, 2007 at 6:38 pm
john jay franklin #877/8,
If you wanted to solve problems you wouldn’t have quite. Bub-bye.
Ummm, can you try English this time? I spend my time and my life solving problems Mr. Pots, Tina, NON-tex-material guy. You spend your time and your life pointing out problems and creating them. I don’t expect you to understand. It’s kinda like a jeep thing, but in this case, it’s an adult thing. You wouldn’t understand. Bub-bye.
New idea on a new name for you. Dunce. It fits.
How does the Q kool-aid taste?
899–Jerad Smith–I agree. I notice that there are more than one person that Tex (aka Tina, Dunce, Mr. Pots) will not answer, just insult. The Clintons do the same thing. It usually means they got caught. I tried many times to actually have a dialog with him, just to meet insults. I don’t consider myself overly intelligent, just an average guy, but my questions and comments seem to be too much for him. But, as one of my dear friends is so famous for saying, you don’t have to be smart if you are right. However, that being the case, there are actually a few people not Team affiliated on this blog that can have a solid conversation and disagree with respect and even come to see your point of view, even if they still disagree. Those people are so refreshing. Keep looking for them. Just a hint, they are not named Tex.
November 13th, 2007 at 12:04 pm
marc #900,
That’s easy. I am writing mainly to the new readers, who could easily be misled by your inaccuracies and lies. Sometimes it takes a few more words to untangle the mess you create with your posts.
November 13th, 2007 at 2:53 pm
Anne, #896,
The argument that Quixtar is trying to cut out the IBO by enabling shoppers to order directly from Simplynutrilite and Quixtar sites is getting so old. It’s classic echo-effect on the ‘Net. There’s been a lead program in place for several years. The volume from the “walk-in” shopper is assigned to an active, Platinum IBO in her geographical vicinity. That’s one of the things that’s driving me to go Platinum, so I can be eligible for these freebies.
November 13th, 2007 at 3:24 pm
Tex: Oh, you meant Bob Ufer. Gotcha.
November 13th, 2007 at 3:51 pm
Wow Tex and ajgannon I had repeated *John Jay Franklin’s blog 879* and then refuted it with my commentary below which stated
John J you did not go far enough see simplynutrilite.com check out statement below: the customers are assigned to existing IBO to assist them in future purposes or they can elect to continue on their own without assistance. The pv/bv is assigned to IBO’s in the area and I have already received pv/bv on a couple of orders. So I don’t think Team is right on this one. Hmmmmmmmmmmm! below is text on the checkout page of the simply nutrilite site
” Quixtar offers online shopping with a personal touch. Every customer is partnered with their own Independent Business Owner (IBO) to provide individual service and answer questions.
Sharing your contact information allows your IBO to alert you to sales offers and special promotions and deliver you personal shopping assistance. Sharing your order details (excluding credit card information) allows your IBO to ensure you are pleased with your purchases and to answer specific questions you might have about products. The more you share your information with your IBO, the more he or she can help you when you need it.
Your IBO has agreed not to share your information with any non-affiliated third parties.
Yes, it’s OK to share my contact information with my IBO.
Yes, it’s OK to share my order details with my IBO.”
November 13th, 2007 at 4:12 pm
MightyPeace #903,
Thanks, I’m glad you enjoy reading them as much as I do writing them. Many of them state they skip over my comments, then say all I do is insult them. If they had actually read and responded to my posts, we would be much further along, but they don’t do this. Trouble is, they don’t realizing I’m just playing with their minds, which makes it even funnier. So all I have to do is toy with them to get them upset, sort of like pulling a wing off a fly and watching it try to fly (I’ve never done this, just heard it being done, for you pro-fly TEAMtosterone filled Orrinites).
November 13th, 2007 at 4:41 pm
Team wins again. Maybe Alticor just better let TEAM go. Is the UK next? I believe so. After the UK, which country will be next, France, Germany or Japan?
November 13th, 2007 at 5:28 pm
Tex,
You said…
“Arbitration processes still rely on facts, but the rules regarding what evidence is allowed are much more liberal and less able to be restricted by tricky lawyers compared to a normal courtroom. This is what will get Orrin and Co. in BIG trouble.”
This post is a PERFECT example of how you spin things to your own purpose. Of course you like the idea of not having to deal with traditional rules of evidence. You argue all day with rumor, hearsay, and speculation. So, what you meant to say was apparently that the rules regarding what evidence is allowed are much more liberal and more able to be spun and manipulated by tricky lawyers. The rules of evidence serve an important purpose, as inconvenient as they may seem to you. But, then again, why would you ever want to bother with authentication and verification of facts?
November 13th, 2007 at 10:16 pm
Tex:
“I spend much less than $350 to get 100 PV. CRAZY, like a fox.” Where is the fox now since until just recently you have been very adamant that you are NOT an IBO with Quixtar and now you are claiming this??? And you expect people to believe you because you tell them to? What a joke!!! You have PROVEN that you are not trustworthy or believable from anyone that want the truth and the facts!
Anne #896,
Do you REALLY believe what some yahoo reporter writes more than the rules and direct statements to the contrary from A/Q? Have you ever considered just because a “distributor” (shows you how up to date this reporter is, the term for the past several years has been IBO, not “distributor”) isn’t needed for the sale doesn’t also mean an IBO doesn’t get credit for the volume?
This is even more priceless, regardless if Quixtar is telling the truth or not you are saying not to believe “some yahoo reporter” and to believe Quixtar because you and Quixtar tells us to. Especially since Quixtar has proven that they are in the habit of sneaking in different rules and telling people one thing and doing another, and this is who we are supposed to believe? Also the word distributor has been used off and on by even people in the business, even a non-distributor one day and a distributor the next day such as you should know that.
November 14th, 2007 at 3:10 am
Tex #904
“That’s easy. I am writing mainly to the new readers, who could easily be misled by your inaccuracies and lies. Sometimes it takes a few more words to untangle the mess you create with your posts.”
It’s ironic that you say that especially when I’ve provided you with actual news articles when you asked for supporting evidence of my arguments, and yet when I ask you to do the same, you either refer me to another blog post by some random dude, or you simply say, “I don’t have to give you a reference.” To anybody reading this post, you can now see who is doing the misleading with “inaccuracies and lies.” Now I know why you have lengthy responses to my posts (which you said you don’t have any respect for my opinions), which is because you are afraid that people will see the truth with the evidence I have to back up what I say, unlike you. Unless they are equally blind and close-minded, who would honestly listen to someone ramble without backing up what they say without facts? Enough said.
November 14th, 2007 at 3:44 am
tex 892
You don’t know if he’s right or not.
November 14th, 2007 at 9:24 am
Hey were is the update about judge sullivans ruling from alticor. Tex have you updated our readers on that. I have not been on here in a while so forgive me if you have.
November 14th, 2007 at 9:43 am
Administrator #906
Thank you for the link to Bob Ufer. Even though he died in 1981 he is still reveared in Michigan. Hopefully many people will click on the link and see what a “true blue” loyal “Michgan Man” he was. And then I hope people will start to understand that loyalty is one of the greatest human characteristics. If you believe in it, stick with it with ardert support. That is what TEAM is doing with Orrin and Chris. It is obvious that we sit on opposite sides of the fence in this so called ‘dispute’. But as the mud slinging, name calling, and downright dirty accusations fly, it’s nice to see a bit of civility. Thanks again.
Tex #887
I applaud your admitting to your mistake….your only one this year? I see you also have a sense of humor. This is no place to start talking football, but yes, I am sure Bob rolled in his grave after the humiliating loss to App St., I still cry. O.k. Back to reality.
November 14th, 2007 at 10:57 am
TEX, TEX, TEX, TEX, TEX, TEX, TEX, TEX, TEX, TEX, TEX, TEX, TEX, TEX, TEX, TEX, TEX, TEX, TEX, TEX, TEX, TEX,TEX, TEX, TEX, TEX, TEX, TEX, TEX, TEX, TEX, TEX, TEX,TEX, TEX, TEX, TEX, TEX, TEX, TEX, TEX, TEX, TEX, TEX,
Enough already go home, log off
Take Alticor Media Blog Administrator with you.
November 14th, 2007 at 11:20 am
G #897
“‘I’m not going to look up a reference for every single fact I post here.’”
“Translation from Tex-eze: … Actually I’m not ever going to look up a reference for any of MY factz, since they aren’t actually facts but rather conjecture and opinion that I’ve repeated so often here that you should now accept it as fact, just like I have. Why can’t you PAY ATTENTION to my factz!!!!
Marc, you might also note that Tex is now all in favor of a lower legal “bar” for his “heroes”, the Corp barristers. Apparently they couldn’t get their over-inflated egos over the higher one. Perhaps bringing it down to … oh let’s see … 1,000PV level would suffice. Yes?
Why We Fight? (pick your part) … apparently because no one left in Ada besides barristers and 2nd gen founders, with none of them knowing how to BUILD anything other than an argument.”
HEAR! HEAR! or is it HERE! HERE!
sorry it took me awhile to respond. i didin’t realize other people were paying attention to our posts. and i’m glad you/they are!!! especially in light of Tex’s recent responses to mine.
November 14th, 2007 at 6:52 pm
Bridgett, Tex and anybody who thinks Quixtar has been warning Team (about the way they teach building) for years. . .
Watch this clip http://the-q-whistleblower.blogspot.com/
As far as Quixtar being Team’s supplier. . . Look at the definition of MLM on the amway site.
http://www.amway.com/en/BusOpp/business-opportunity-or-pyramid-scheme-10082.aspx
“Multilevel or “network” marketing is a lawful and legitimate business method that uses a network of independent business owners to sell consumer products supplied by an established company”.
That is not the whole thing, but based on that it looks like at least Amway would be the ‘established” company that products were supplied from.
November 14th, 2007 at 9:19 pm
Marc #910
You are right on the money there! Tex figures that if he puts enough words on each post that what he is really saying won’t be noticed by anyone. Kinda like the saying: You can’t see the forest for the trees.
November 14th, 2007 at 9:52 pm
tex #887
I wasn’t talking about my upline either, I was talking about the majority of people in America most of whom want a good deal on anything they buy.
If it is not a good deal they don’t want it. take tolsom shave gel, I tried it, it was ok, yea its got special ingredients that one could say makes the product a “top of the line product”. However when all is said and done, Its just shave gel, I put it on and scrape it off. It doesn’t foam up as much as the much much cheaper products that give you more product in a smaller can, and cost per use is even more of benefit. People just want products that work for a good deal, and read the ingredients when their sitting on the throne. I could name all kinds of stuff I bought like that including food, which come in smaller quantities for higher prices than I could get at the corner store, I have to go there anyway to get perishables, so why wait or pay for shipping?
November 15th, 2007 at 12:41 am
Tex: You only call the Tool Money a scam because you were never good enough to make any PV money or tool money… You’re the guy that complains about the NBA players making too much while you are watching a game or complaining about Nascar drivers making too much money (a little for winning and alot for endorsements). You can’t respond to your lack of success without just calling it trash talk and smelling bad. And you say Q has made strides… Great, only because of the UK and the Team leaving! I don’t polish the achievers pin,(you don’t have one) I make money. And last… you do have time to blog on a medical, political or any other site, because you don’t show the plan. HA HA HA HA You don’t have the guts to build the business you defend so you blog like you are making a difference. Stay in fantasy land, stay broke. Oh and High Income and Tool Money go together have you forgotten? Keep it straight. Like I said, Low Income, Low IQ.
November 15th, 2007 at 11:44 am
warrior-for-truth #908,
Why don’t you go away and find out which country is next, and come back and tell us after you find out?
Rich #910,
When did I ever say I was not an IBO?
This is even more priceless, regardless if Quixtar is telling the truth or not you are saying not to believe “some yahoo reporter” and to believe Quixtar because you and Quixtar tells us to. —- That is NOT what I’m saying. I’m saying to look at the facts and use logic. This appears to be a foreign concept to you.
Especially since Quixtar has proven that they are in the habit of sneaking in different rules and telling people one thing and doing another, and this is who we are supposed to believe? —- There was no “sneaking” of rules, it is the IBOAI and the uplines’ responsibility to train and motivate their IBO’s, which includes the rules and rule changes in my opinion. Quixtar could have made the issue more visible, but the upline and IBOAI ultimately dropped the ball.
Also the word distributor has been used off and on by even people in the business, even a non-distributor one day and a distributor the next day such as you should know that. —- The word distributor made a lot more sense when we did product pick-up. Now with the free customer shipping, it makes even less sense.
November 15th, 2007 at 11:46 am
marc #911,
It’s ironic that you say that especially when I’ve provided you with actual news articles when you asked for supporting evidence of my arguments, and yet when I ask you to do the same, you either refer me to another blog post by some random dude, or you simply say, “I don’t have to give you a reference.” —- I don’t have time for your nonsense, simple as that. If you want to know the facts, go and look for them. The facts are available, but you have to want to learn them.
To anybody reading this post, you can now see who is doing the misleading with “inaccuracies and lies.” Now I know why you have stupid responses to my posts, which is because you are afraid that people will see the truth with the evidence I have to back up what I say, unlike you. Unless they are equally blind and close-minded, who would honestly listen to someone ramble without backing up what they say without facts? Enough said.
November 15th, 2007 at 11:51 am
AEM #912,
I have well over 12,000 tapes and CD’s from all the major lines of sponsorship and have listened to at least some from most of the lines of sponsorship. I have also noted most of the tool companies charge about the same for their tools by reading the blogs. I know.
team ibo #913,
The moderator has said they intend to post a thread. I have commented on that lawsuit on other threads, and will save further comments for that new thread.
November 15th, 2007 at 2:32 pm
In2Win #917,
Thanks for the free “plug”. Have you heard the saying that there’s no such thing as bad publicity? Thanks again, and again….
mark #918,
“‘I’m not going to look up a reference for every single fact I post here.’”
“Translation from Tex-eze: … I’m not going to look up a reference for every single fact I post here.
Actually, I am in favor of keeping it in a court, so we can learn more new and important things like Orrin making $10 million/year on his tool scam.
Why We Fight? (pick your part) … apparently because no one left in Ada besides barristers and 2nd gen founders, with none of them knowing how to BUILD anything other than an argument.” —- Are you suggesting non-lawyers take the cases to court or arbitration? Are you suggesting Jay be removed from his grave, or Rich come back from his retirement to handle this at 80+ years old? Give me a break.
November 15th, 2007 at 2:37 pm
AEM #919,
What’s your point?
Rich #920,
It comes down to not wanting to explain things from the beginning over and over again. You can look up the facts just as well as I can, you just want to keep consuming your TEAMtosterone instead.
ben #921,
You told you to be 100% loyal to the products, Quixtar or your upline? There’s the rub.
November 15th, 2007 at 2:58 pm
tex,
So tool prices are roughly the same across the board. I don’t read many of your posts about tool prices, but I do see a lot of talk about a ‘tool scam’ from you. You seem to hover around 2 points : the promoters are not up front that most of the money from ‘the business’ comes from tools, and that the profit is not shared equitably with IBO’s. Feel free to correct me if I’m wrong. If you understood about the Team system you’d know both those concerns are moot. The ’scam; you describe does not exist in Team. The fact you continue accusing Team of doing things they don’t and teaching things they don’t leads me to believe that what you think you know. . . you don’t.
November 15th, 2007 at 3:08 pm
confused #922,
I only call the Tool Money a scam because it is one. How much PV I make has nothing to do with the tool scam being right or wrong. You are trying to use selective ethics. Sorry, that doesn’t work.
Where have you seen me complain about sports or any other endorsement money? It is common knowledge these folks often make a lot more in endorsements than their salary. Most of them can be found easily on the internet. Not so with the “kingpins”, and they claim to be our “business partners” and “teammates” to boot. That’s what makes them lying cowardly “kingpins”.
My lack of success come directly from the tool scam, as most IBO’s I sponsored either could initially afford the system or went broke trying to use it.
I think the Q strides have come mostly from the UK changes, TEAM had very little impact, except for us knowing much more about the TEAM tool scam, which also helps us understand other tool scams better.
Oh and High Income and Tool Money go together have you forgotten? Keep it straight. Like I said, Low Income, Low IQ. —- High income and tool scam money don’t go together in the UK any more, and this will soon be true in the U.S. as well.
November 15th, 2007 at 6:35 pm
Tex #924
“I don’t have time for your nonsense, simple as that. If you want to know the facts, go and look for them. The facts are available, but you have to want to learn them.”
If you want ANYONE to give you the time of day to listen to your opinions, you have to be able to provide facts and evidence. If you merely respond with, “go and find the facts yourself,” it shows that you actually don’t have the facts and have been blowing hot air all this time. I have provided you with the facts when asked, and you can’t do the same.
November 15th, 2007 at 8:25 pm
Tex
You mentioned that in the earliest posts, I believe on here and on the freetheibo blog. I’m not surprised that you don’t “remember” it.
ALSO: To anybody reading this post, you can now see who is doing the misleading with “inaccuracies and lies.” [Yes we can see who is doing the misleading.] Now I know why you have stupid responses to my posts,[they only seem stupid because you believe that anyone who disagrees with you or has a differing opinion is stupid, which is probably most of the people on this planet] which is because you are afraid that people will see the truth with the evidence I have to back up what I say, unlike you. [Now this part is priceless, the only way that you have “backed up” what you say is that you apparently believe that if you say it, that is backing it up and NO ONE has the right or capability of disagreeing with you] Unless they are equally blind and close-minded, who would honestly listen to someone ramble without backing up what they say without facts? Enough said. [Again priceless, I will mention again in a different way, just because you say it does not mean that it is “God’s Truth” and that there is no room for a different thought such as the real and actual truth.]
November 16th, 2007 at 12:46 pm
Tex,
Care to explain how exactly TEAM is running a tool scam? They have one of the best profit sharing programs of any of the organizations…and they don’t lie about it. The fact that we all know that a significant amount of money comes from the tools is enough evidence alone to show that it isn’t a scam. Have you heard one person from TEAM on any of these sights be surprised that money is being made from tools?
November 16th, 2007 at 12:55 pm
AEM #928,
If what you said is true, why wouldn’t the TEAM office or my upline Platinum and Emerald answer my questions regarding the size of the tool profits (this was well before the TEAM blowup on August 9th)? Why don’t YOU post how much is made on the various tools? We know it varies between $1-10 Million for the 1% that make tool money, according to the recent lawsuit that Orrin and Co. “won”.
If the profit information isn’t known, there is no way one can answer the question of whether it is shared equitably. Therefore, I only have an issue with your first point, the lack of being upfront about the true business model (Quixtar plus tool profits).
November 16th, 2007 at 2:28 pm
I just watched the You Tube video with at least on Quixtar representative, possible two (that is what it says but his face is not shown) applaud TEAM, Orrin and Laurie, Chris and Terry, and Tim and Amy for being “great leaders”. This seems a bit off if Quixtar has been trying to correct them for 6 years. Sure you may not publicly disparge them if you are trying to get them to correct something, but you certainly do not show up at an event of the TEAM and publicly state they are the best.
Makes little sense to me. And then we hear from Mr. Devos himself talk about the opportunity and the fact that people are free in this business? A little scetchy again, wouldn’t you say?
I know TEX this is all about the tool scam as you call it. Fact is it is as voluntary as you walking into WalMart or Barnes and Noble and buying a book or CD. If you want it buy it, if not, don’t. It is called voluntary exchange. Did you catch that Voluntary.
Now if you choose to buy it, do not complain that it is a scam if you do bot read it and then apply it. Do people that have the biggest business make the most meny from tools? Of course. Just as the perosn who has the most PV flowing through their Quixtar buisness makes the most.
Are their some former(maybe or maybe not) IBO’s that push the system? Probably. It is good information, but again I think you must be an adult to sign up, make your own choices (Voluntary). The fact is if one uses the information in the CD’s and Books one can grow as a person which will help them in all walks of life. It helped many people in the Quixtar business and it will help many more in a business that is easier to build. I
I guess we will all have to wait and see how that all works out in the near future.
Has anyone heard anything on the suit brought against the 30 no named bloggers that were getting paid by Orrin and Chris. I applied for that job but I guess the Hooded Angry Man was a better option:) Oh well, I will continue to grow.
November 16th, 2007 at 6:54 pm
ajgannon—Thank you for your well wishes. It is appreciated. I wish more non-team people were like you, then this problem would be cleared up and past much more quickly and admiralbly. Thanks again.
November 16th, 2007 at 8:10 pm
Tex#927,
Wow, I wonder why you aren’t allowed to post on the other, much more reputable blogs…I’m having trouble believing that freetheibo wouldn’t love having people call each other “dirtbags” on their blog.
Hmpf…go figure.
That aside, tool compansation in TEAM is very simular to volume compansation in Q. That means, dirtbags not withstanding, you are the one trying to use selective ethics. And for once you are right…it doesn’t work.
November 16th, 2007 at 11:47 pm
Is there really ‘too much tex’?
Let’s see…
Post #927 from tex
Post #926 to tex
Post #925 from tex
Post #924 from tex
Post #923 from tex
Post #922 to tex
Post #921 to tex
Post #920 to tex
Post #919 to tex
Post #918 to tex
Post #917 to tex
Post #916 to tex
Post #915 to tex
Post #914 to tex
Post #913 to tex
Post #912 to tex
Post# 911 to tex
Post #910 general comment
Post #909 from tex
Post# 908 to tex
Post #907 to tex
Post #906 reply to Anne
Post #905 from tex
Post #904 to tex
Post #903 to tex
Post #902 from tex
Post #901 from tex
Post #900 to tex
Hmm…
November 17th, 2007 at 1:59 pm
tex, mr. pots, suzy, dunce says
My lack of success come directly from the tool scam, as most IBO’s I sponsored either could initially afford the system or went broke trying to use it.
Hmmm, went broke paying for a six dollar cd. I currently pay 12-15 for a cd that is for nothing but entertainment, and I usually buy at least one a week (I really like music, but books on tape/cd are great too). Not to mention my books I have to read to keep ahead in my industry tends to cost as much as a college textbook, not 12-15 dollars. So, the tools are cheaper than any other industry I have personal experience with, and I find them extremely valuable not only for this business, but everything in my life. How does one go broke like that? Oh, maybe it’s the $15 shaving gel, or $70 per month for vitamins, or maybe Shameus McSteeley was onto something!!! Why is it that Q can charge so much more than average prices and deliver above average products and services and most everyone here can defend them yet Team charges much lower than average prices and much more than average services and education and suddenly people go broke? Tex, are you sure you weren’t an accountant for Enron? With math like that, you should be a congressman. You could help those people borrow their way out of debt.
November 17th, 2007 at 6:01 pm
Parrotex,
If you failed in building the business, that means you failed. Why should we listen to a complaining, blaming everybody else Failure. Oh, yeah if that is who you are no wonder you couldn’t keep a Team of people. Blaming, complaining can’t learn from his own failures, that type of person can’t even make friends and making friends is the core of building any business. Of course the only word you can understand from talking to you is BLAh, blah, BLAh, blu, blah.
November 19th, 2007 at 11:26 am
Judge Anderson of Kansas says “In my opinion, the treatment by AMWAY/Quixtar of former and current Quixtar IBOs in terminating IBOs without following its own Rules of Conduct or, even, its historic treatment of IBO behavior it regards as inappropriate; threatening suspension or termination of IBOs; and on-going use of the legal system to intimidate and control IBO activities violates principles of basic fairness and reeks of injustice in its simplest terms.”
November 19th, 2007 at 8:18 pm
Parrotex,
Ha, ha, ha, that is funny. Arbitration over a lawsuit. Give me a break. Arbitration wasn’t set up for a punishing people because they sued the company. Arbitration was set up so people couldn’t sue them. Plus arbitration was set up for the IBO to go and resolve disputes not the other way around. There is no dispute remember “Just Go, Team” and they did. Everybody is in full agreement. Isn’t that just wonderful.
November 19th, 2007 at 8:44 pm
I love it… Dirtbag. Every time you get caught in a pinch you resort to calling someone with knowledge and not theory a name. Typical liberal style combat. You don’t know what you are talking about but you keep arguing. Now what do you have to say when the Judge in MI says that Team is a legit business, not a scam? The court heard all of the information from BOTH sides and made a good decision. So there goes your Scam theory.
I don’t think going head to head with Q is cowardly… Not showing the plan is cowardly. Your lack of success is based on the fact that you won’t gut it up and go show the plan. But you choose to blame the tool “kingpins” because they don’t post their earnings on the internet for you to read… Now that’s the ultimate “pass the buck” excuse for the year. You get the “pass the buck to failure” award. Now you can say you have achieved something.
November 20th, 2007 at 1:35 pm
AEM #919:
I checked out the video, and like everything from TEAM it is full of half-truths and distortions.
I’ll stick to the very last comment on the video:
“Internal consumption makes this an illegal business.”
Internal consumption has never been illegal. It is still not illegal. It however has been made a order of the court to certain pyramid schemes, that they can only continue their scheme if their external consumption meets a certain level.
November 21st, 2007 at 3:12 pm
Jerad: Point well taken. The reference was uncalled for, and we’ve removed it from the comment in question.
November 21st, 2007 at 4:47 pm
marc #930,
I gave you several references to look up. Have you bothered to do that yet?
Rich #931,
Mentioned what? Reference the earlier post by number that you are referring to.
Anyone who researches the internet for Amway, Quixtar, tool scam, Anderson, TIF, Stewart, Hart, Morrison, etc., can easily find evidence of the tool scam.
Clint #932,
TEAM had an interesting way of sharing their tool scam. They had a contract that indicated profits are not to be discussed, and 2 high level TEAM “leaders” state Quixtar told them not to share this information. That is a scam, pure and simple.
Monster Mash #934,
Did you expect the Quixtar executives not to show up? Did you expect them to show up and describe Orrin and Chris in lukewarm terms?
You clearly do not understand the tool scam. Publicly, it is voluntary, but privately it is required.
November 21st, 2007 at 4:52 pm
Jerad #936,
My derogatory term for the post by confused #922 “Oh and High Income and Tool Money go together have you forgotten? Keep it straight. Like I said, Low Income, Low IQ.” was meant to counter his not so subtle jab at my IQ.
TEAM compensation was NOTHING like Quixtar compensation. One is above board, the other is not.
toomuchtex #937,
Look like not enough Tex. I’ll work harder.
November 21st, 2007 at 4:58 pm
john #938,
Your personal examples are far from typical. Most people don’t spend that much money on those items, and you know it. You are also “forgetting” all the functions, which probably create a large portion of the tool scam profit.
Also, you are missing the point, like looking from the wrong end of a pair of binoculars. The key is the tool profit. This would be a much more honest business if the tools cost the same but the profit was given to an external company or a charity.
Your attempt to cherry pick a couple of products and ignore the quality factor and all the other products is not surprising from an IBO high on TEAMtosterone.
November 21st, 2007 at 5:03 pm
Tauraus #939,
I haven’t failed, because I haven’t given up. Like Orrin and the rest of the TEAMtosterone clones did.
john #940,
Good job of taking an isolated statement out of context.
Tauraus #941,
They broke a rule with that lawsuit, so it is subject to arbitration, just as any other rule violation is. The impact of any rule violation factors into the punishment. You lose. Again.
November 21st, 2007 at 5:26 pm
confused #942,
I already addressed the “dirtbag” issue, above.
The judge was very perplexed by the tool scam, but because it wasn’t part of the “agenda” he didn’t investigate it in depth. Did you “miss” that part, or conveniently ignore it?
If my self-proclaimed “business partners” and “teammates” lie about their source of profit being mainly the tools, there is no “passing of the buck”, unless you count the tool scam bucks being passed to them.
Piet #943,
The reason for the external sales is to show the products are reasonably priced. This helps prove the business is NOT a pyramid.
Admin #944,
The reference to low tool scam profits making for a low IQ (#922) is the inappropriate comment, I was merely returning the “favor”. This is an example of how hard it will be to enforce a “code of conduct”. If you want to prevent my return volleys, then you also have to go back and remove the statement that caused my statement to be made.
November 21st, 2007 at 8:13 pm
Admin#944,
Why did you remove that offence and not all of his others? Is it only important if it is pointed out?
You can give me all the excuses you want about the amount of spam you have to go through from Tex or maybe it’s just that you do this in you spare time…whatever.
The point is this is why Tex isn’t allowed to muddy up the blogs that have actual standards.
Now, I would love for Q to quit suing us over their own lies so I can quit defending myself here. Howsabout we make that happen?
November 22nd, 2007 at 11:38 pm
Educational
http://www.podcastdirectory.com/podshows/704057
The tex strategy is to highjack the blogs and drown out everyone else.
November 23rd, 2007 at 2:57 pm
Tex #926 —- “Are you suggesting non-lawyers take the cases to court or arbitration? Are you suggesting Jay be removed from his grave, or Rich come back from his retirement to handle this at 80+ years old?”
Not at all - Think we’re suggesting that someone in Ada learn to develop BETTER PEOPLE SKILLS so business could be conducted outside of litigation.
We both know better people skills can be developed, right?
“Give me a break.”
As for break - whatcha looking for - 90% of posts from or to you?
November 25th, 2007 at 11:06 pm
#947 Tex, actually many people do spend that much on those things. The three things that make people go bankrupt are cars, entertainment, and food. So yes, most people do spend that kind of money I was speaking of.
Number two, I haven’t forgotten about the functions, which are about the same price as cheap dinner and movie with my wife (and I take her out once a week and the functions are only once per month).
Three, why would someone be in business to give away all their money? It does not make anything more honest to give it all away to charities, for that is one of the things the mob did. Why is it wrong to keep a profit on the services and product that people choose to use, unless you believe in Communism?
Four, I haven’t cherry picked a few products and I haven’t ignored the quality factor. I can go through each and every product if you wish, but that would take months at least. Yes, the products from Q cost more and yes they are of a higher quality than most. Look at my comparision from the previous post. Q is high quality and very high prices. Team is high quality and very low prices. That is the comparision.
Five, I am not an IBO high on TEAMtosterone because (a)TEAMtosterone is simply something in your mind because all leaders on team can think for themselves and (b)because of Q’s actions against me and my team I am no longer and IBO.
tex #948, that was not an isolated statement and it was not out of context.
November 25th, 2007 at 11:31 pm
Tex #945
the only reference you ever gave me regarding rule violation notifications to Orrinn et all, was some blog post from some random blogger who had no idea where he got the info from. when asked, i have given you real references from actual news articles/videos, so is it too much to ask for you to give me a REAL reference? or do you admit it doesn’t exist?
November 26th, 2007 at 9:44 am
TEX:
DID YOU READ “WHY WE FIGHT PART 1″? IT READS:
“They have interfered with non-compete agreements. They have interfered with non-solicitation agreements. They refuse to arbitrate.”
“But most of all, we are filing suit because TEAM has taken proprietary business information from Quixtar that IBOs could be using right now to build Quixtar businesses.”
AND THEN YOUR QUOTE:
“You clearly do not understand the tool scam. Publicly, it is voluntary, but privately it is required.”
What I do understand is that YOUR AGENDA is what you refer to as the “tool scam”. ALTORAMQUIX clearly states why they are filing suit above. Nothing in there does it talk about tools.
Now before you jump the gun and go off and refer back to the problems thay have been trying to fix the past 6 years, re-watch the YouTube video.
Again you state, and I quote “Did you expect the Quixtar executives not to show up? Did you expect them to show up and describe Orrin and Chris in lukewarm terms?”
I would not expect an executive of Quixtar to show up and say those things if in fact they were not true. If their were truly problems (in Quixtar’s minds) then they would not publicly disparge or publicly support (and in this case go beyond just supporting) TEAM. I can see why they would not put down TEAM publicly if they were “working” with TEAM leaders on major issues (things that put them and others at legal risk) but I cannot see them on a TEAM stage stating they are the fastest growing team within Quixtar and how the build is not stacking if in fact they considered it stacking.
I don’t see what I am missing. Those that call it a tool scam are most likely the ones who do absoulutly nothing with the information from the tools.
I do not know who your upline leader was/is, but I do now that the information is beneficial to my everyday life, my community building, and so forth. My upline leaders do not require I buy the CDS, BOOKS, or go to the meetings. I choose to. WOuld they stop helping me if I did get off system. They have already. There is no privatly required tool scam TEX.
If I were your upline TEX (your right, thank god I am not)I can see not working with you if you were not on system and you dealt with people the way you deal with them on this blog. I am sure your a splendid person with great morals and values, you just have not shown it yet.
See you in St. Louis!
November 26th, 2007 at 9:58 am
Tex #948
Your comment on the arbitration vs. lawsuit is all wrong. I have an outside business and my contracts call for arbitration should a dispute develope. This contract is designed with my profession in mind and is gearded to reduce frivilous lawsuits against me. I have a client who refused to pay me ($35,000). I tried to sue him but his lawyer got it thrown out of court due to the arbitration rule of the contract. So what do I do now? I’m going to arbitration, and I have not been “punished” because I first attempted a resoultion in court. In fact, I am very confident I will win in arbitration due to the nature of dispute and the arbitration is geared to protect me. Orrin and Chris understood that the arbitration agreement with Q is geared towards them. The lawsuit was filed,I believe, as a “let see what happens and if it fails we will have to go to arbitration, if we lose that then we still wait six months”. Either way they don’t end up in a worse position than when they started. You don’t get “extra punishment” because you attempted to flank the arbitration process. The only reason why the judge dismissed it had nothing to do with context, only procedure. And the “dismissed with prejudice” only means no other lawsuits can be filed on this.
November 26th, 2007 at 12:01 pm
Tex,
Definition of Scam: A fraudulent business scheme; to swindle.
Now, it seems to be well known from everyone posting here and everyone I know on TEAM, that the leaders make more from tool profits than what they did make from the quixtar business. TEAM has one of the most intricate profit sharing plans for tools than any other mlm business. Are you upset that they make money off of tools? How is it that TEAM’s money making system is any more of a scam than any other business??? Have you ever paid to go to a seminar not related to an mlm? Or how about a CD? You should spend your time looking up the RIAA scams instead of legitimate business practices. TEAM does not lie about their profit sharing system… just ask your upline about how it works. I’m tired of hearing your B.S. based off of hearsay.
November 26th, 2007 at 12:52 pm
Jerad #950,
They would have to remove all of your offenses as well, which would result in very few posts left from you, and would take a lot of effort to review.
November 26th, 2007 at 12:55 pm
toomuchtex #951,
It’s only educational if you learn something.
G #952,
The “better people skills” option went out the window when Orrin and Co.’s “illegal pyramid” lawsuit was filed. You need to get a clue.